US AGAINST THE MEDIA What a bullshit stupid motherfucking idea that was. With 1:50 left, Raiders cornerback Eric Allen, while lurking at the Patriots' sideline, heard Brady's talk with Weis. 6-keys: media/spln/nfl/reg/free/stories, By pressing sign up, I confirm that I have read and agree to the. So if the quarterbacks hand is technically going backwards when the ball is being tucked, and the ball comes out, it should be a fumble. [14] Patriots owner Robert Kraft noted that Al Davis was probably looking down from the afterlife and happy that the rule had been abolished. I think everybody probably sees that and says it's a bad rule. Pereira said in 2005 that the rule comes up in games about 12 to 15 times per season, so it shouldnt be just associated with the Patriots-Raiders play. If the decision had remained a fumble, it would have almost certainly sealed the game for Oakland. QB is trying to throw a screen pass, gets bumped, running back drops screen passfumble. As it happens, his last game involved the Patriots. Kurt Warner suffered injuries the following season and was eventually released. This rule is fine, its only the whining fans of teams that are unable to do their jobs well enough to win that want this rule changed. Not much would have changed for Belichicks legacy, either. Nope. Kicker? "More than 68 percent of the leagues passes are short throws that target receivers either behind the line of scrimmage or within 10 yards of it. It was the right call. The owners abolished the rule with a 291 vote, with Pittsburgh Steelers the only team to vote against. (This was also the game in which Patriots quarterback Drew Bledsoe was injured by a hit from Mo Lewis, giving backup Tom Brady a chance to play.). These situations should have been ruled fumbles all alongthe tuck rule has caused unnecessary controversy. Game was over and every player on the Raiders sideline was celebrating the victory only to be thrown back onto the field to win a game they had already won. Im sure its no consolation to the many Raiders fans around the country., Keep the rule and let other teams feel the pain and sorrow I still feel from that cold wintry night 10 years ago. Brown fumbled the ball at the end of the return, but Pats linebacker Larry Izzo recovered it with 2:06 left on the clock. For one, do you know anything about football? (#94 -> #33, for example). Doesnt that now become a fumble because the passer held onto the ball past the predetermined point of a throwing motion? but hey, at least they didnt bring out the snow plow for their FG attempt-or did they?? If you remove it, we open up a basket of worms, and fans will be upset a lot when their QB gets hit while his arm is moving forward and the ref says he was trying to reset, so it is a fumble. Had the play been ruled a fumble, the Patriots would have lost . Dont let the damn lawyers write the rules anymore. Moreover, you Patsy fans will say let it go because it was years ago now, and yet, when the Tuck Rule happened, you all immediately called it justice for the Ben Dreith game. And, no, he would not have lost his job after coughing the ball up. Photos (and replay) clearly show Brady with both hands on the ball before its knocked out. When [an offensive] player is holding the ball to pass it forward, any intentional forward movement of his arm starts a forward pass, even if the player loses possession of the ball as he is attempting to tuck it back toward his body. @ Monkeesfan Register now! mrconnors says: It was 2001. In 2008, Brady suffered two torn ligaments during the Patriots' season-opening game with the Kansas City Chiefs. Cant have that! 1-seeded Steelers to even get to the Super Bowl. According Paragraph 3036 of Marine Corps Order P1020.34G, which governs uniform regulations, wearing an olive-drab undershirt while in cammies is optional, though in the case of parades . (This was also the game in which Patriots quarterback Drew Bledsoe was injured by a hit from Mo Lewis, giving backup Tom Brady a chance to play.) The way the rule was written, you could probably pump fake, pull the ball back, hang out for ten minutes, have a beer in the pocket, and then fumble, and it's incomplete. The call was overturned upon review and ruled an incomplete pass, with the tuck rule cited. "[12] Several Raiders players and observers also said that the Tuck Rule led to head coach Jon Gruden's departure from the team, as owner Al Davis was apparently angry that Gruden did not protest the call vehemently enough. joesixpack doesnt know what a fumble is either. terumiarai says: With less than two minutes left to play, the Patriots drove the ball down the field. If it goes against the Raiders, reverse the call on the field. Its really more sadness and pity than anything. After NFL owners voted 29-1 to repeal the controversial Tuck Rule at the annual meeting in Phoenix on Wednesday, it is no longer in effect. This rule is fine, its only the whining fans of teams that are unable to do their jobs well enough to win that want this rule changed. Blame the ones that make the rules- Perreira does a great job explaining the stupid a$$ sh!t. owners passed a rule by a vote of 31 to 1 that will enforce Coughlin's point. But on replay, Carey said it was an incomplete pass because of the tuck rule. The final was Gruden's last game of his first stint as head coach of the Raiders; he was traded to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers before the following season. When did the tuck rule first become effective? Think it through a little bit more. Such a tough call. Raiders defensive backCharles Woodson tackled Brady, causing the ball to land on the field and allowing Oakland linebacker Greg Biekert to recover the football. At least not right away. IF that scumbag didnt have money on the game and the raiders win then the Raiders go on to win the superbowl for the next 3 maybe 4 years . Most Patriots fans will even admit they were given a gift on that play. ", The Raiders responded to the video on Twitter, saying, "Knew it.". Mike Pereira, the former director of officiating of the NFL, noted that the design of the rule avoids the question of the quarterback's intention,[1] except that the referee still must judge whether the initial forward movement of the arm was "intentional". Because the play was initially ruled a fumble, instant-replay rules required the referee to see "incontrovertible visual evidence" on the replay that Brady had not "tucked the ball into his body and then {lost} possession" of it before reversing the original call on the field. Though honestly, if the Patriots win it all this year, Ill be way over that as well. sick and tired of Pereira, self-promoting pompous a$$, he would support such a change who cares. PRIDE AND POISE RAIDER NATION There was less than 2 min left in the game when that fumble happened Unlikely the Pats wouldve gotten the ball back. "[11], The Raiders complained extensively that the call was wrong, and that it was made against them because the league had a vendetta against the team, an attitude Oakland quarterback Rich Gannon said was "totally nonsense. whats a td what isnt (calvin johnson, arian foster and someone else) During ESPN's new 30 for 30 documentary called, "The Tuck Rule", the future Hall of Fame quarterback admitted that if he didn't lead the New. Is the tuck rule, on the other hand, still in effect? Allen stated that he heard the Patriots' play call. Teams that were the victims of blown calls in big games? The tuck rule was abolished on March 20, 2013, by a 291 vote of current teams. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. To say that the Raiders simply were beaten by the Patriots is one of the stupidest things I have ever read. worst call in history of sports. Any ref who cannot see that is a fumble with more than one look should not have a job as a ref. Now to take a look at this play and the impact it had, let's take a time machine back to 2002. https://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/01/nfl-tuck-rule-game-new-england-patriots-oakland-raiders-what-if, that brilliant Super Bowl game plan he devised for the Rams, his game plan for Super Bowl XXV against the Bills is actually in the Pro Football Hall of Fame, 2023 NFL Combine Winners Day 2: It's (another) bumper crop of cornerback talent, LaDainian Tomlinson's nephew going through drills at the combine is sure to make you feel old, 17 NFL greats who were terrible at the scouting combine, Where to watch the NFL Combine, live stream, TV channel, Defensive Backs, The Bears have a smart reason for playing darts and mini golf in their NFL combine interviews, A Seinfeld clip was brilliantly used to analyze John Lynch's body language for Trey Lance talk, The Red Sox found a loophole in the MLB shift ban and it stinks for Joey Gallo, The Warriors left Russell Westbrook ridiculously wide open and it worked to perfection, Survivor 44: Meet the castaways who will compete for $1 million in Fiji, Watch: Man tries feeding bison near Yellowstone; it doesnt go well, 2023 NFL Combine Winners Day 1: Blazing-fast DTs give the Bears plenty to consider, Ranking all 32 NFL teams' helmet logos, from worst to best, How bald eagles really sound (it's not like in the movies), Your California Privacy Rights/Privacy Policy. The Jets tied the game with a field goal on that drive before going on to win 10-3. Tuck rule or not the raiders got robbed. [17], Up to his retirement at the end of the 2018 season, Coleman officiated 265 more NFL games, including 21 more involving the Patriots, but none involving the Raiders. After Brady dove to the 5 and centered the ball, Vinatieri kicked a 23-yard field goal, giving the Patriots a 1613 victory and advancing them to the AFC Championship Game. How about game winning play by the defense. - Yes maybe it was the correct rule or whatever, I'm not arguing that. In 2008, Brady suffered two torn ligaments during the Patriots season-opening game with the Kansas City Chiefs. It is the "Tuck" rule. Secondly, the call on the field was correct no matter how out of the blue it seemed at that time. Tom Brady finally admits Tuck Rule play 'might have been a fumble'. Brady posted his confession on social media, rekindling a. In week 2 of the NFL season in 2001. Jan 11, 2011 12:09 PM May 5, 2022 2:22pm. Never mind. Really? After the Patriots maintained possession, Brady completed a 13-yard pass to David Patten to the Raiders' 29. On the play following the incomplete pass the Patsies would pull the same trick by having Brady take a hit on a pump-fake. The rule not only changed how referees call the game, but it also altered the trajectory of TB12's career, according to . January 16, 2019 10:09 pm PT. It's a ridiculous idea. Second, the Raiders had every opportunity to win that. And as I said in my earlier post, the Pats lost a game earlier that year against the Jets I believe it was because of the tuck rule being called in their favor. are you still mad because Seymour loosened up your fat schnozz for the Ravens to bust it open like a pinata at a bday party?? But its not as if St. Louis would have replaced New England as the NFLs most successful organization. Incomplete pass? A fresh investigation into New England's conduct has reignited debate over the moral background of the organization and its long history of pushing boundaries of the NFL rulebook under Bill Belichick. If your loser team was that great why couldnt they stop the drives after the tuck play ? if 50 guys at the bar think it's a fumble, then it's a fumble. Gruden was asked about the "Tuck Rule" before the Raiders played the Patriots at Gillette Stadium on Sept. 27 . Pereira opined on the tuck rule because it was applied on Sunday, when Chiefs quarterback Matt Cassel went back to pass and dropped the ball when he was hit by Baltimore's Lardarius Webb. So enough with your fantasies that the Patriots won that game fair and square, with or without the rule. They have their best season in years andthey fire their coach.. Ive been a Raider fan for over 20 years now and this is my first post. Well guess what, the raiders won the game when Woodson forced the fumble and Beikert fell on it. But that aint what this is Einstein this is an ACCEPTED AND ESTABLISHED RULE that was PROPERLY APPLIED. Yes, keep the rule until each team has experienced it at least once. That gave Brady the starting role over veteran Drew Bledsoe entering the 2002 season and the rest is history. With the tuck rule the entire motion is covered, so there is no room for the ref to screw it up as a judgement call. The rule works; people have a hard time with it because they want to think the 2001 game was ruined by it. Bullshit. Here's the thing. There should also be some kind of rule that stops the Patriots from acquiring draft picks in one year, that turn out to be better the next. This is a subreddit for the NFL community. In it's place, the following was added to the rule book: "If the player loses possession of the ball during an attempt to bring it back toward his body, or if the player loses possession after he has tucked the ball into his body, it is a fumble. The Raiders were robbed of another shot at the AFC title and a potential trip to the suber bowl. Replays showed there was no illegal contact. In the end JUSTICE prevailed. The nation was still recovering from 9/11. Instead of 4th and long with a little more than a minute remaining, it became first and goal. - But on replay, Carey said it was an incomplete pass because of the tuck rule. On Wednesday, N.F.L. Jan. 19, 2002 is a date that will always live in infamy for Raiders coach Jon Gruden. I dont question whether the rule was correctly applied. All they simply had to do was have Rich Gannon kneel and the game was over. Today marks the 15th anniversary of the most controversial use of replay in NFL history. When can I drink milk after taking iron supplements. Im sure its no consolation to the many Raiders fans around the country.. Later in the quarter, Patriots receiver Troy Brown returned Shane Lechler's 37-yard punt 27 yards to the Patriots 46-yard line. In the aftermath of the Tuck Rule Game, Patriots head coach Bill Belichick told ESPN, "I knew what the ruling should have been because we had dealt with that play a little bit earlier in the year on the other side of it. Please check your email for a confirmation. Get over it, pathetic Raiders fans. You can't see the line of scrimmage on the field. Before you go spitting your bs about roughing the passer not being called, how about watching the replay again and again and again. Nonetheless, Raiders quarterback Rich Gannon completed 10 of 14 passes for 87 yards. . benh999 says: The 2001 AFC Divisional Playoff game between the New England Patriots and the Oakland Raiders, also known as the Tuck Rule Game or the Snow Bowl, or sometimes referred to as Snow Bowl 2, took place on January 19, 2002, at Foxboro Stadium in Foxborough, Massachusetts, which was at the time the Patriot's home stadium.The game, played under a heavy snowfall, was the last at Foxboro Stadium. Uhh, I do believe it does make sense for the QB to be in the act of passing for it to be ruled an incomplete pass. Pulling the ball back is not passing and should be no different then a running back not securing the ball and getting it stripped away. This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. He then rushed to his sideline and told his team what he had heard. When discussing Tom Brady and the "Tuck Rule," Ray Lewis was referring to the game-changing call made by the referee during the 2001 AFC divisional playoff game between the New England Patriots and the Oakland Raiders. [13] The Pittsburgh Steelers voted against abolition, while two teams, the Patriots and Redskins, abstained from the vote. While they were slightly out of field goal range, Brady dropped back to pass and dropped the ball after being hit by Woodson. Brady began a passing motion, but then ceased, before tucking the ball with his left hand. Such a tough call. Is, To avoid this problem, you may need to take iron with a small amount of food. It was 20 years ago today, when the Patriots played the Raiders, in a snow bowl matchup often referred to as as 'The Tuck Rule Game." The resulting win, leading to an incredible run of postseason victories and Super Bowls for former Patriots quarterback Tom Brady and the Patriots. Cassells was the real tuck rule. In most cases where the Tuck Rule has been applied, the call would have been a fumble in those other associations. Agree the play alone didnt lose the game for the Raiders, but the emotional swing in the game after that call was reversed was obvious. Tom Ruggie, one of RWE's principals, runs another RIA called Ruggie Wealth Management that keeps most of its $210 million of client assets with LPL Financial. The rule means that a potentially key fumble could now be deemed an incomplete pass. THE 'tuck rule' in the NFL is regarded as one of the most controversial in sports history. So what would have changed? First, the Tuck Rule was not only a bad rule, but it wasn't applicable on the basis of overwhelming evidence and the Raiders got screwed. Tom Brady fumbled and the NFL would not let the dreaded Raiders win. A lot of people see the incident as one of the NFLs great what ifs. An existing rule was strengthened as a result of this. Backup quarterback Tom Brady then led the offense to a playoff berth. Luke Straub. It makes no sense to allow a QB to act like he is going to throw the ball, not let it go, then try to pull it back & then drop it in a tucking motion but then get to keep it. He's already completed his "pump" the ball has come back and touched his other hand. Here's the official ruling, from section 22, article 2 of the NFL's rulebook. IMO -if the QB is so pressured by the defense that the ball comes loose,if forward motion doesnt carry the ball past the line of scrimmage (or to the feet of an eligible receiver in the backfield) then it should be a fumble. Bill Polian (Colts) is the chairman. How about this rule. Think Pereiras pension and/or benefits from his former employer may be lost in the mail? thats why we have instant replay now. While I'm not arguing with you, but I know the general thing now is that if there's not enough evidence but only a sliver of evidence to overturn it, they won't. Great games shouldnt come down to a obscure rule that when seen by the human eye at games speed LOOKS LIKE A FUMBLE EVERY TIME! You had your chance the next season, and the Bucs beat you by 50 touchdowns Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. @tooz56 "The Tuck Rule" changed Tom Brady's career. So, either way, Grudens time in Oakland was likely over. Brady has six championship rings and nine total Super Bowl appearances, the most of any player in history. THE 'tuck rule' in the NFL is regarded as one of the most controversial in sports history. It should have been inconclusive. Whine about 1976 all you want Patriot fans. Many feel it was a controversial play that allowed New England to move on, win their first Super Bowl and set the tone for all that have accomplished since. In the second half, New England almost completely abandoned its running game and relied on Brady's passing. I dont even think Cassel was tucking the ball. Press J to jump to the feed. And having the help of replay, the ref ref who overturned the fumble should have been fired on the spot. That ref had money on the game so he made up a rule. We prevented your team (assuming you would have beat the steelers ((big assumption by the way)) ) from embaressing yourselves for two consecutive superbowls. The Tuck Rule was a rule in the National Football League (NFL) that stated that if a quarterback lost control of the ball while trying to bring it back to his body (and it was not because he fumbled it), it would be called an incomplete pass, not a fumble. Knowing what we now know about Belichick, is there any chance he was turning down a first-round pick from the Bills and the opportunity to shed the richest contract in NFL history? I agree to receive the "Pick Six Newsletter" and marketing communications, updates, special offers (including partner offers), and other information from CBS Sports and the Paramount family of companies. Please explain Einstein how you can have an incomplete pass without first throwing the football? In the closing moments of the fourth quarter and with the Pats trailing by three, Brady received the snap and stepped back into the pocket to pass. elyasm, the arm doesnt even have to be moving forward at the time the ball is knocked out to make it an incomplete pass. If the Raiders pull out the Tuck Rule game, they are probably losing one of their next two games, and doing so in embarrassing fashion. He then got hit and fumbled.